This is a place to talk about how YOU buy automobiles. I've bought cars this way and it is the best in my opinion:

1. Go to the dealership late at night when nobody is there and find the exact car/truck you want

2. Write down the EXACT MSRP, options, delivery, ect.

3. Take that info home and go to Edmunds and get the invoice for the car and every single option (double check with KBB)

4. Browse every single forum known to man that has to do with the vehicle you want and find out what people are paying and buyer experiances

5. Get pre-approved thru your credit union/bank

6. Once you have ALL of your information and the price you want to pay, Email every dealer within 50-100 miles for their best price

What are you guys methods for buying cars?

NO.

This is an Automotive Financing Forum.

Having a bad day? That was pretty rude man, hang in there, it will get better!

Nope not rude the key words are AUTOMOTIVE FINANCING FORUM!!

Go Marv...........

I don't have a problem with that dude, get of Marvbears nuts!

RB4580:

I expect a modicum of civility by any poster.

I expect creditboard members shall refrain from posting sexual innuendoes that are in poor taste and offensive.

I expect to be disagreed with.

While you have viewed my initial response to your thread as rude, I did not post with the intent to be rude. I was merely interjecting a comment that this was an Automotive Financing Forum.

I have been called rude and condescending by many. Perhaps this is how my written personality comes across also. However, I will not mislead nor misdirect any creditboards member, regardless of how my posting comes across.

Your original post does contain some merit; however there are a number of things about your post in its overall general nature that may not be to the end consumer’s best advantage.

I have routinely chosen to shy away from such general advice, as it is likely to not serve the majority, since each person’s situation is different. If you strategy works for you, then I am glad for you.

I expect you to adhere to the first two paragraphs in THIS post.

I expect NOT to warn you again.

Is it just me or does'nt #5 (5. Get pre-approved thru your credit union/bank) not directly relate to "Automotive Financing"? Last time I checked credit unions and banks do car loans................hugh very interesting. But I do understand that dealerships make less $$$ when you bring your own financing to the table and they do not appreciate it at all.


RB4580, it is nice to see people thinking for themselves.

No you missed the entire point this forum is about AUTOMOTIVE FINANCING not how to buy a car.

Two totally different things.

Welcome back

Oh, Marv youre so sweet but I never went anywhere. Im always here.

Well I am certainly glad you are here watching out for everyone

Marv, I think they have PMs for a reason, but you are very welcome.

Well, yes creditboards was designed that way WHEN PM's are necessary/needed.

You are a funny man Marvbear

Well.......... on the whole, I do believe I prefer being called funny, rather than rude, condescending, stupid, ignorant, or perhaps even troublemaker.

If the shoe fits......................I'm refering to the "funny" comment of course :wink:

Well looka here...Marv has a fan....stalker....PITA lifeless troublemaker???
How about ALL OF THE ABOVE!! :idea:

Geesh.....and where does THIS post(SHOE) fit??


What iota of something constructive or positive do you have to add to this or any other thread? :roll: :roll:

Most people have to "finance" an automobile to "buy" it. So I think it relates. Thanks for the post and has anyone heard of Free Speech!

relation or not, nothing is free, including speech....and no one has the right to ridicule Marv on this privately owned forum. The OPs initial post may have been in the gray area of relating to auto FINANCING but Marv was doing his job to keep in in perspective....
Subsequent replies have been nothing more than attempts to taunt him which is against TOS....
Why cant folks fix their credit, ask questions about auto financing without causing problems......and if ya feel the need to be a lil mischievous, at least have the backbone & %%%% not to make up screennames to post under when ya use a different one to post under normally....

so obvious & ignorant.... :roll: :evil: :roll:

Are you nuts! I am not the same poster with a different name. I am a poster that read the post and found it intresting and informative. If this board was meant to be a B*tch fest "as it seems to have turned in to" you are right on target. If one person reads a post and learns from it the board has done its job. I learned, so Marv should be happy. You are not in a third world country and yes last time I looked at my constitution speech was free. When these boards began to censor, what we lose are people like the original poster who may have been able to contribute down the road. He was shunned so "bye-bye" opinion, and hello dictatorship!

I perfer to not engage in "school yard" bully fights. Have fun Tee.

I am glad you edited that just then.

Reading is Fundamental...no one said YOU were using more than one screen name....I said "subsequent replies", namely pixichic, but in ya paranoia ya took offense...Oh well...

If ya speech is so free, go as some of the servicemen ovef in Iraq....or the mother who watched her son's flag draped coffin being lowered to the tune of taps...
This is CREDITBOARDS...AUTO FINANCE FORUM....save all that other rhetoric for where it belongs....The OP was warned what was acceptable & if that scared him away, so be it....I hope pixichic takes heed as well......Because Marv is very helpful, he is appreciated....attempted taunts & such arent.....

Uh yeah. If you're looking for a 'casual' fluffy forum where you can just say whatever. Wrong place. If you really are interested in learning how to finance a vehicle under your particular circumstances. Right place.

MarvBear is not one to just sit head-to-the-sky whistling while people in this forum just post 'whatever' or say 'whatever' as if its completely sound advice, when its not. There are people sincerely interested in learning how auto financing works. Of course, what you personally do in selecting your car is your business; if it works for you, great. But this is an AUTO FINANCING forum.

In a general CAR forum, the first post would probably swing among the others. In an AUTO FINANCING forum the first post was neither here nor there. How people select a car has little to do with the financing itself and its terms and most of the time, people spend so much time researching the car and researching the price that eventually lose out in the end because they don't know how to negotiate terms and how financing actually works.

MarvBear has always given solid information and advice on auto financing. However, if you are accustomed to just clicking from one forum to another where people just blurt out their ideas as if they have tourettes whether they are appropriate to the forum or not there are other forums on other sites where this is the norm and I am sure they are waiting for you.

I agree and thought you were speaking directly to me. The brothers in Iraq are fighting for "Freedom". Don't talk to me about burying service men, I have already done that. Unless you have, you have a lot of nerve speaking like you know how I feel. Marv, is great. I just think it is important to open up to all relating comments as it can help someone later. I have to move on to better threads but good luck, as you will need it in life.

Don't ask me why I am still posting to this thread, it seems relentless. I only belong to this board and credit. I always get great info from both. Like I said before. I know this is not a "post all" but the guy talked about financing at a CU, ahh the key word is "financing". Am I blind or did everyone miss that.

You guys win! Lord, I will never comment to the posting Gods again!

It seems Pixichic got her wish AGAIN.

This is double frustrating to me to have to moderate in such a fashion and double dissapointing that some see things as a dictatorship or as a GOD posting forum.

I have never been blessed with patience as a virtue nor a tolerance for bigotry, stupidity and troublemakers.

So, after I have given this some thought I shall further respond, as I think there is some misunderstanding present and further explanation will be forthcoming.

So I will allow this to continue as long as it remains civil.

And so everyone should be aware the only censorship that has been exercised is by one poster who edited his own comment.

I will respond shortly.

My point exactly. Did you learn how auto financing works and how to negotiate from the OP's post? If you did, then you must be riding a bike in the desert. Only someone who is lost and completely clueless would have learned anything about FINANCING from that post. The OP thought as he said above it was a CAR BUYING forum (whatever that implies in his mind), but by what is reflected in his post he thought the selection was most important since he said that one should go to "every single forum known to man" and find out how others bought their car? Hmmmm... I suppose if you did that, then by the time you finished the first year depreciation on a new car would have kicked in and technically, you could save some $$. :shock:

Marv. Bear that was me. I deleted my posting because I was being childlike in my comment. I know you do not censor but I felt like some people were trying to run off the first guy. It seems the "posting police" got angry about me encouraging free comments. I nevered accused anyone of censoring, just that discouraging could be seen as that. I never read your board much and feel like the credit forum it much more civil. I hate that people cannot accept everyone with knowledge and feel sorry for the first guy.

by the way how do you only see credit board comments when you hit the "home button". I always get auto and mortgage.

samb5, it was civil till this cat fight started. MarvBear keeps a VERY CIVIL as well as Professional Board here.

Atleast here in the Automotive Financing Forum you'll get REAL information from a F&I veteran. I don't think there's one person in here that wouldn't want Marv to come with them when they "Finance" their next auto.

Marv doesn't need to baby-sit this childish bickering going on in this thread. I wouldn't blame him if he locks it. :8)

[quote="RB4580"]This is a place to talk about how YOU buy automobiles. I've bought cars this way and it is the best in my opinion:

1. Go to the dealership late at night when nobody is there and find the exact car/truck you want

2. Write down the EXACT MSRP, options, delivery, ect.

3. Take that info home and go to Edmunds and get the invoice for the car and every single option (double check with KBB)

4. Browse every single forum known to man that has to do with the vehicle you want and find out what people are paying and buyer experiances

5. Get pre-approved thru your credit union/bank

6. Once you have ALL of your information and the price you want to pay, Email every dealer within 50-100 miles for their best price

What are you guys methods for buying cars?[/

C'mon people. :roll:

The OP was asking for input from others on what their methods for purchasing vehicles are. The OP also posted his personal experience here.

And frankly, this IS the most suitable forum to post this thread in! Where else would one post this thread? Huh?

Y'all need to stop attacking people.

Are you watching me as I type my reply MarvBear? Did you see where I erased where I called you rude? Huh?

What started out as a potentially informative and comparitive (as in from personal experiences) thread has turned into a bashing thread.

Why? Because the moderator started it!

You are supposed to be more professional in your demeanor. That is why you were chosen to be a moderator, correct?

[quote="sirrowan"][quote]This is a place to talk about how YOU buy automobiles. I've bought cars this way and it is the best in my opinion:

1. Go to the dealership late at night when nobody is there and find the exact car/truck you want

2. Write down the EXACT MSRP, options, delivery, ect.

3. Take that info home and go to Edmunds and get the invoice for the car and every single option (double check with KBB)

4. Browse every single forum known to man that has to do with the vehicle you want and find out what people are paying and buyer experiances

5. Get pre-approved thru your credit union/bank

6. Once you have ALL of your information and the price you want to pay, Email every dealer within 50-100 miles for their best price

What are you guys methods for buying cars?[/

C'mon people. :roll:

The OP was asking for input from others on what their methods for purchasing vehicles are. The OP also posted his personal experience here.

And frankly, this IS the most suitable forum to post this thread in! Where else would one post this thread? Huh?

Y'all need to stop attacking people.

Are you watching me as I type my reply MarvBear? Did you see where I erased where I called you rude? Huh?

What started out as a potentially informative and comparitive (as in from personal experiences) thread has turned into a bashing thread.

Why? Because the moderator started it!

You are supposed to be more professional in your demeanor. That is why you were chosen to be a moderator, correct?[/quote]

Perhaps you missed the point...Marv simply WARNED when the OP seemed to be taking the subject elsewhere....Could he have been mistaken, perhaps but I really think you are pressing it by saying HE started it when an obvious troll( not the OP) came in bashing from the door.....
He TRIED to contain the issue when he said perhaps there hadnt been a meeting of the minds and things died down...YOU are getting em riled back up with the "unprofessional" remarks....
By the way, NO ONE was attacked EXCEPT Marv...perhaps you missed that....

Okay here is how I see it and take it for what it is worth (in todays market I don't think you will get more then $.0143215 for it - but could try to sell it on eBay for slightly more):

The OP posted a mothod they believe works well for purchasing a car. There is nothing with running an idea by someone or asking for a brainstorm of other ideas.

If that had all that was posted, no one would have their feathers ruffled in the least. But the OP went on to present themself as the "authority" on it, and then even further to act as the "authority" on what this forum was designed for.

This has happened in other forums here as well (I can give the Business Credit forum for example), and all it takes is a little reguiding to take it back on topic and continue a good discussion.

I believe this was MarvBear's intent, and his style is a cut straight to the point kind of style. That has brough a great Moderator of this forum and we appreciate all that he does. While his style is different then other's (we all have our weakness and strengths) it makes the point clearly.

If the OP's intent was to really foster a discussion about different techniques to buy a car, by all means please redirect this conversation back to that, IF his intent was to cause drama by acting as the know-all to this forum, then I ask you to please take that to your "other boards" where apparently they like it.

For everyone else who jumped in, to either try and solve the issue or stir more **** in the pot, I ask that if you want to discuss the original topic, then add to this thread, if you are just trying to cause drama - your work here is done.

And that is my never-to-be-humble-opinion,
Jessica

And at this point I would like to thank the poster sirrowan for adding me to his/her ignore list. Only the second time this has happened to me. I feel honored, you will not have to read my RUDE replies now sirrowan.

((Marv))

Marv's advise has helped SOOO many. It sis show threw out this forum. I am sure countless others that never join or post have been helped also.

By no means does Marv deserve to be attacked. Period.

Misunderstandings can happen, after all we are all human. However, we DO NOT ATTACK THE BEAR.

Well....

I have read this thread...as well as the posting history and demeanor of the posters involved...

And...I WILL say that Marv was NOT trying to be rude at all....even took the time to explain that that wasnt his intent...but apparently, that wasnt good enough.

Many of you know that mods are here on their own time...we do NOT receive compensation for the time we spend here...nor do the owners/admin for that matter...we are here because we CHOOSE to be...just as YOU are...

Marv runs a tight ship...which is greatly appreciated. The whole purpose of his response to the OP was to make sure that the OP AND OTHER MEMBERS didnt lose sight that this is an AUTOMOTIVE FINANCING FORUM...rather than a forum that tells you how to buy a car. Marv did NOT counter the OP's strategies...only made a simple statement...and from there, things escalated.

Yes...buying a car usually DOES involve financing....but, the key point is that the purpose of this forum is as Marv stated.

Honestly, had this post been made in any other forum...it probably would have been moved here....and STILL would have received the response relating it to a financing forum as opposed to one dedicated to purchase tactics and selection methods.


And...for those of you who choose to instigate matters further...stop. No one is censoring...no one is curbing free speech...no one is preventing anyone from sharing experience relevant to the topic...but I must say, I am a bit shocked by all the flying poop.

I was just wondering if anybody read the first sentence???? This is my opinion AND I said this is a place to let everybody know how YOU buy automobiles. This could have been the most informative thread on this board but instead it's turned into me being a know it all ect.... This is sad! Grow up and drop your ego's, IT'S A MESSAGE BOARD!

RB, just let it go... case closed... Forget about it

Have a great weekend. :8)

I can see how someone would feel that a suggestion of how to buy in a way that he considers smart has a place on these boards. These boards are here because many of us have not made wise decisions in the past, or are trying to be wiser about our finances now.

If you look up at the top, you will see "The F&I Car Guy question." That thread was begun in September 2003. F&I Car showed up on the credit forum one day, and started answering questions about auto financing, how it works, what F&I guys do. He gave tips about what to say and do and what to avoid, when dealing with car salesmen, dealerships, and F&I guys in general. Inside information.

He obviously wasn't here to drum up business, he just want to join in and help consumers deal with the mysterious workings of automotive financing. He was a big hit. The F&I car guy question grew into a huge thread, and people were flocking to the board, just to get good info so they could go make a good deal at the dealership.

After a couple of months, we approached F&I Car Guy about being a forum lead in a new forum about automotive financing. A forum lead is not just a moderator, a forum lead is a professional in the field - like Fla-tan is the forum lead in the mortgage forum. The ones we select really know their subjects, have demonstrated that they really want to help consumers, and that are not here to prey on the consumer's ignorance, but to increase the consumers' knowledge.

After a few months, F&I Car Guy encountered some real life personal issues (family health), and wasn't able to participate as much. somewhere along in there, MarvBear showed up and just began answering questions about automotive financing. He was doing a good job - we were watching, because none of us could answer the kinds of questions an F&I guy can answer. We could tell our experiences, etc, but we did not have the inside info of someone who actually works with it every day.

Thinking that F&I Car Guy would be back (we still think he will), we asked Marv Bear if he had time to officially accept a position as a forum lead, along with F&I Car Guy. He agreed, and he has demonstrated not only his expertise, but his willingness to help people.

If you go on most message boards, it is very different than our boards. On most public message boards, it is an exercise in free speech, no holds barred. Anyone can claim to be an expert, dispense advice, with no regard for the outcome. Many times a person will show up, post for a short period of time, then disappear, and there is no follow up, no consistency - you are still on your own, sometimes worse off than when you started.

On all our boards, we want to make sure our members are getting real information that they can use to improve their situation. Many have been abused and exploited, and are fighting to find their way back from financial troubles, often because they have been undereducated or even misled in financial, legal, credit or other subjects. We offer the education, moral support, hand-holding, encouragement - just about whatever it takes to get going and be successful with financial and credit matters.

We want our boards to be boards where members can trust the information they get. It probably isn't all perfect (what is?) but we do our very best, including taking some flack, enduring criticism, etc, to make sure that if you ask a question the answer you get will be helpful, not harmful.

Obviously, this is what people are looking for - we get approximately 20 new members a day, and our members actually donate money - real money - to support the board. They want to make sure it is here for them and others who need help. So, we believe very strongly that what we are doing is right, and it's what our members want.

So, sorry this is so long, but I hope it gives you folks in this thread the overall picture - why a forum lead or moderator jumps in, with what seems to be arbitrary selection, to correct a poster, or answer a challenge. On this board, that is their job.

Now one further thought - there are some very self-sufficient, well-educated, independent-minded consumers out there. They don't want advice from "pros" - they don't trust "pros". They are the "for sale by owner" types, the strong-minded shoppers, determined not to be taken advantage of by someone who (perhaps) has been trained in the "tricks of the trade." Quite often they have good reasons for being the way they are. They got taken once, and are determined not to have it happen again.

When these strong-minded consumers find our boards, with the brokers and F&I guys answering the questions, they feel an automatic urge to challenge what's being said (sometimes indirectly), not realizing what is actually taking place here. In their efforts to challenge what they perceive to be the "industry spin" they cast aspersions on the professional person who has chosen to share the "tricks of the trade" and "inside knowledge" with the members here.

Our forum leads are immediately put on the defensive, or so it appears, for no real reason, because at that point, the entire purpose of the board is being challenged.

We're definitely not against the "do it yourselfers" - educated, hard-bargain driving consumers. But the fact is, most of our members are not that way (yet) - that's why they're here.

Many of them cannot just walk into a credit union and get a car loan. If the dealship refused to accept their CU check, they would cave - they wouldn't know what to say. When the dealer asked for their license they wouldn't know how to handle it, even if they had done all their shopping and made their decision, had their financing lined up. They need to know more about the process, so they are ready for whatever comes up when they walk into the dealership (or the mortgage broker's office, or the insurance agency).

What it boils down to is this - MarvBear is our F&I guy. He's taking his time to answer questions, both on the board, and off. He spends a great deal of time doing this. We want him here, we need him. He does his job here - help consumers, and keep the board on track, keep things going smoothly.

Tomorrow, if a member has a question, they can post it and MarvBear will be here to answer it. If things don't go the way our member thinks they should, the member can come back and ask again. MarvBear will be here. If something goes wrong, MarvBear will be here to help.

I hope this history/summary helps define things for those of you who are new. Have fun, learn something new, and be nice to each other.

Breeze that was great!

I am not in the market for a new car right now I already have enough 2-2003's and 1 - 2004 but I often read Marv's post and find out good information for future purchases. I finally have my finacial house in order but one can never have too much information.

Marv is doing a great job here and I am sure it takes a lot of his time, I agree having to be on the defensive is not the best way for him to spend his time and effort.

Kudo's for a great response!

This thread was starting to make me mad....

I honestly think this sums it up...

Forum Posts = data.

Data = information stored elecronically.

We are not paying for these forums, they are offered to us as a free resource. Not only is MarvBear highly helpful, but he was clearly trying to keep the usage of forums for unrelated subject matters to a minimum. MB = money, as any real world server admin can tell you, so since we are not paying for said MB, we should keep the non-relevant banter to a minimum. I apologize to the owners of this site for my own unecessary usage of it, but I felt it may make some people think.

Auto-financing forum = the process of selecting financing terms, locations.

Auto-selection process = General Discussion Forum!

Some people are trying to quickly look for the information we want about financing and financials. Too many of these and our search times would increase, and MarvBear's effectiveness at answering financing-related posts drops.

Anyone who wants to skew the "Get pre-approved financing" as a tip in the auto financing process, go ahead and skew it, but the simple fact is that it's a subject covered in much deeper detail in other posts.

IMHO, if it doesn't have to SPECIFICALLY have to do with the financials, it doesn't belong here. General Discussion is there for that. Sorry, just my honest opinion, not bashing anyone. Time and place.